Attackers not attacking

[wildman]

I ended my turn on the campaign map having decided not to attack the enemy just yet, I focused on positioning my units and preparing to attack maybe the next turn.

So, the computer makes its moves and has decided to attack some of my forces. Ok no problem. I enter the battle and set up defensive positions ready to hold off the assault, I set a few initial orders then click to start the battle.

I wait... and I wait. Nothing, I wait some more, still nothing. It seems the enemy has dug in and has absolutely no intention of attacking. So I spent an hour or more carefully positioning my troops defensively in order to resist an attack that never came.

Now I hadn't chosen this fight, I was happy to wait, the AI attacked me on the campaign map but in the battle itself it was me who was forced to launch an assault from my defensive position.

Obviously it didn't go well, I had to cross the open ground that I was expecting the enemy to traverse and although I eventually forced them to retreat and took a lot of territory I also lost a lot of valuable units that I would never have used in the way I was forced to.

My question is why does the AI sometimes initiate a battle on the campaign map but not actually attack on the battle map?

[FB_AGA]

Initiating a battle on the campaign map does not only mean an attack. It is also a recon which could be done with different strenght. AI is fair, so without a recon it does not know players force.

[wildman]

Initiating a battle on the campaign map does not only mean an attack. It is also a recon which could be done with different strenght. AI is fair, so without a recon it does not know players force.

The enemy sends recon units, that makes perfect sense. What I don't understand is why that means I have to enter a full scale battle?

On this occasion the enemy was dug in deep in the forest, I was planning to attack north of this position the next turn and then try to attack them from behind. Why does an single recon unit initiate a full scale battle situation? maybe we could get an intel report that says something like -
 
'your forces have spotted an enemy patrol @ 113/445'
and then we could have a choice. Attack? Y/N?

The way it is now we have no idea what is happening and we are sometimes forced to do crazy things because we don't know if we are being attacked or not. If we don't want to fight the only choice is to wait 3 hours for the timer to finish or retreat which loses territory.

[FB_AGA]

It is a good question.

A few points as I see it:

1) After 75% of mission's time has passed AI offers a truce. It's nice; however, I liked more when AI proposed a truce as soon as it decided to stop a recon or even at first minutes. At least it could use truce option more loosely.
2) In WWII in the Eastern front atleast combat recon was used widely. So, usually a single squad of the company, a single platoon of the battalion or a single company of the regiment and so on attacked enemy while others were waiting the commander decided to conduct a full scale attack or did something else like stay in the defence or change dirrection of the attack.
3) Recon without an engagement was quite seldom and was usually conducted by an artillery recon.

[Dane49]

Wildman try setting your options like limit battle radius(4.18) to limited and cut your battle time from 3 hours to 1 hour-option (4.04) you can even scale it back to 30 minutes if an hour seems to long.

If you give the AI 3 hours they generally will use 2 1/2 hours setting up an attack and only assault in the last 30 minutes while capturing all the other territory where your forces aren't positioned or they may not attack at all if they determine you are too strong.

[wildman]

It is a good question.

A few points as I see it:

1) After 75% of mission's time has passed AI offers a truce. It's nice; however, I liked more when AI proposed a truce as soon as it decided to stop a recon or even at first minutes. At least it could use truce option more loosely.
2) In WWII in the Eastern front atleast combat recon was used widely. So, usually a single squad of the company, a single platoon of the battalion or a single company of the regiment and so on attacked enemy while others were waiting the commander decided to conduct a full scale attack or did something else like stay in the defence or change dirrection of the attack.
3) Recon without an engagement was quite seldom and was usually conducted by an artillery recon.

I agree with point 1, if the AI is not going to attack after initiating a battle they should offer a truce or maybe withdraw. The option for the player to attack anyway should still be available also. The other points you make are both fair however I am pretty sure that a commander wouldn't rewrite his entire strategic plan as a reaction to a single enemy recon platoon straying too close to his forces.

[wildman]

Wildman try setting your options like limit battle radius(4.18) to limited and cut your battle time from 3 hours to 1 hour-option (4.04) you can even scale it back to 30 minutes if an hour seems to long.

If you give the AI 3 hours they generally will use 2 1/2 hours setting up an attack and only assault in the last 30 minutes while capturing all the other territory where your forces aren't positioned or they may not attack at all if they determine you are too strong.

I really do like 3 hour battles, I just don't like 3 hours of waiting for the AI to decide whether it will attack me or not after it has initiated a battle, surely that decision should be made during the campaign phase rather than on the battlefield.

Even if they sent a single squad to assess my strength and then decided not to fight, that would be better than dragging me to the battlefield, making me position an entire army and then doing nothing at all.

[Flashburn]

I like the 2 hour option.  But have reverted to 1 hour just due to these issues. 

It is good the ai tries, in theory to conduct recon.  But it needs work on all levels of game.  But considering that is my biggest beef that is not saying much. 


Maybe an attack VS recon option that the ai and human could use.  Smaller time limit and an easy way to get the recon guys out of the area in a hurry.   

[wildman]

I like the 2 hour option.  But have reverted to 1 hour just due to these issues. 

It is good the ai tries, in theory to conduct recon.  But it needs work on all levels of game.  But considering that is my biggest beef that is not saying much. 


Maybe an attack VS recon option that the ai and human could use.  Smaller time limit and an easy way to get the recon guys out of the area in a hurry.   

it's the only really annoying gameplay issue I have come across so far, every other aspect of this game is great and even this, once I'd accepted the situation and decided to attack the battle was a lot of fun, even if it made me cry seeing my crack infantry platoons getting slaughtered by entrenched machine guns 

I think a new way to deal with recon skirmishes would be good though, even a simple choice to engage or ignore or like you suggest a smaller quicker battle mode.

[Flashburn]

Well in MY perfect GTOS the area to fight over would be larger per battle (not popular idea), but doing such would have WAY more reason to have to conduct proper recon.  Also doing more realistic movement to contact and the like.  And IMO just better for armored fights. 

But I just hope recon gets some love for mius.  It is the weakest point of the game in GTOS.