ME question

[hemisent]

Thanks Kyth
 I deleted the text file and your narrative popped right up.

[Kyth]

Thanks Kyth
 I deleted the text file and your narrative popped right up.

Don't just stop there, keep going,

There are other subjects to consider:

- Map object Removal or change of colour, in response to triggers
- Map positioning
- Adding Mission objectives in the game screen
- In-game messages

[hemisent]

Oh, I'm not stopping there. The next hurdle will be in game messages. And I'm just starting to read up on and play with triggers. More questions to follow

Cheers all!
H

[frinik]

 Hemi you sure are dedicated and goal-oriented and it's testament to your determination! Don't let go!Under Kyth's guidance you ll be one hell of good missions maker

[hemisent]

Frinik
 Thanks for the vote of confidence, hope I don't disappoint you. If Kyth has the patience to keep answering my questions I'm sure I'll get it eventually.

H

[Kyth]

Frinik
 Thanks for the vote of confidence, hope I don't disappoint you. If Kyth has the patience to keep answering my questions I'm sure I'll get it eventually.

H

Don't worry, just keep those questions coming!
Remember, you're breaking new ground here, no one else has been asking the right questions!

[hemisent]

Ok, here's a question on defense.
  I have a village which needs defending from Russian attackers. I have a contour circling the entire village and have it listed as "village" in the positions section. Now, I have three defense areas within the "village" position: def_area_north, def_area_east and def_area_south. Miscellaneous German units are scattered amongst the three defense areas.

Can I use a single script:
village_defense()
{
   ext, ai_defence, village, 15, 150;
}
and attach it to each individual unit. If so will the northern units for example, stay put if attacked from the south or will they turn and repel or move toward the southern enemies. Since the script says "village" I would think that all units will try to protect whatever is inside that contour from whatever direction.

If I set up scripts for each defense area that means the units only protect that particular area? Or am I missing something here?

I'm getting a headache

[Kyth]

Ok, here's a question on defense.
  I have a village which needs defending from Russian attackers. I have a contour circling the entire village and have it listed as "village" in the positions section. Now, I have three defense areas within the "village" position: def_area_north, def_area_east and def_area_south. Miscellaneous German units are scattered amongst the three defense areas.

Can I use a single script:
village_defense()
{
   ext, ai_defence, village, 15, 150;
}
and attach it to each individual unit. If so will the northern units for example, stay put if attacked from the south or will they turn and repel or move toward the southern enemies. Since the script says "village" I would think that all units will try to protect whatever is inside that contour from whatever direction.

If I set up scripts for each defense area that means the units only protect that particular area? Or am I missing something here?

I'm getting a headache

The "village" itself doesn't need to be a contour, unless it's for an in-game trigger.

Your defensive positions "def_area_north, def_area_east and def_area_south" should be open contours (not closed loops).
The AI will generally try to find a position in one of those contours. Assuming a unit can find a position, the AI will stick to that position for the duration.
Like I said, this is an assumption, because the AI is quite finicky about what constitutes a good defense position, especially for vehicles. The defense contours help, a little,

Read my earlier post about using single-point contours for AI vehicles defense. And, take a look at some of the existing mission scripts. A useful tool is the Mission Editor, where you can watch the battle unfold - watch it with the contours 'on' and see how the AI behaves.

[frinik]

Normlly when you assign a defence area to the units they will not rush forward  and move to other areas whereas with the ambush script they tend to  to just that no matter what the odds are and get killed.The problem I have noticed with the defence script is that some units fight  just a little 2 to 3 shots thne go awhol going off somewhere away from the action and just watch the landscape?

[Kyth]

Infantry and artillery are a lot better behaved for static defenses - place them in trenches or dug-in emplacements, select 'stay in trench' and just assign a dummy script for them. They will stay in place as long as their morale holds out.

So don't pooh-pooh the infantry, they're a vital part of any defense with their satchel-charge 'grenades' 

[frinik]

 Not sure if you were answering me in your post Kyth but I should have specified that the problem I was mentioning had to do with the armoured units.The infantry and artillery/AT are absolutely not a problem in defence mode ( except sometimes excessive passivity until fired upon)

[hemisent]

Here's the status report and my next questions. I have a village which is being defended on three sides north, east and south. All the friendly(German) units are following a script to defend the village(position). The entire village is outlined and set as a position. So far the enemy units are attacking and friendlies are defending as desired except:

1. My infantry units are placed in trenches facing their correct direction. As soon as firing starts they all get up and go running around instead of staying in the trenches. How do I keep the infantry in the trenches?

2. I have a trigger set (trigger01)for the enemy assault to begin when my unit is inside a certain contour (object in)

 Right now some of the enemy is visible from the start of the mission and begins trading fire immediately instead of generating upon the trigger being activated. How do I generate the enemy upon trigger and not immediately(start of mission), or do I have to physically place them all out of line of site.

 Here's the script for one of my enemy units.

rus_adv_north()
{
   ext, wait_tr, trigger01;
   ext, ai_move, village, false, -1, 8;
}

Thanks
H

[Kyth]

1. My infantry units are placed in trenches facing their correct direction. As soon as firing starts they all get up and go running around instead of staying in the trenches. How do I keep the infantry in the trenches?

You'll have to select the 'stay in trench' option in the divisions tab. The icon with the blue 'down arrow'.

2. I have a trigger set (trigger01)for the enemy assault to begin when my unit is inside a certain contour (object in)

 Right now some of the enemy is visible from the start of the mission and begins trading fire immediately instead of generating upon the trigger being activated. How do I generate the enemy upon trigger and not immediately(start of mission), or do I have to physically place them all out of line of site.

Place them out of sight, they don't generate themselves  I hope you're using the 'autoplay' tool in the Mission Editor. That's really the fun part about mission-building,

[frinik]

  YEAH! Autoplay is really fun!!!

Hwemi you ccan set or regulate the speed at which the AI ( friend or foe/Armour and infantry) is moving.There's a slider you can use in the ME( also found on the ME toolbar).This way you can delay first contact to avoid premature fighting between opposing units.Sometimes the AI can be frighteningly fast and screw your plans...

[Kyth]

Timing is everything in mission design
Just set them loose and watch them go in the Mission Editor. I can't tell you how many times I caught the AI doing something odd and unexpected this way, so it teaches you a lot about what works in the game, beyond any written explanations. And it helps a great deal in assessing mission balance (not too easy, but not impossible).

[frinik]

  Kyth do you ahve a recipe for Ai that goes awhol during a mission?
It happens to me usually with units of 3 tanks, assigned a defence script wuih a well defined defensive positon.All other units in the same area will behave correctly take up thweir position and  fight off the enemy untl exterminated or vitctorious.However It seems there's always a group of 3 tanks which fight fight for 5 minutes , fire a few shots and if not killed or incapacitated in any way will then leave the battlefileld wander off far away from the action and then take position with the commander poking out of the turret and just stare into the horizon.Sometimes but not always, after 10 minutes of sightseeing, while their side has been soundly defeated or victorious ( no trigger applied) one or 2 of them will turn around and head back for the battlefield.

I have tried different tricks or tactics to solve the problem; changed the units positions, script, added triggers nothing works.This happens in various different scenarios with different tanks or spgs...Any idea???( short of court-martialling them)

[Kyth]

  Kyth do you ahve a recipe for Ai that goes awhol during a mission?
It happens to me usually with units of 3 tanks, assigned a defence script wuih a well defined defensive positon.All other units in the same area will behave correctly take up thweir position and  fight off the enemy untl exterminated or vitctorious.However It seems there's always a group of 3 tanks which fight fight for 5 minutes , fire a few shots and if not killed or incapacitated in any way will then leave the battlefileld wander off far away from the action and then take position with the commander poking out of the turret and just stare into the horizon.Sometimes but not always, after 10 minutes of sightseeing, while their side has been soundly defeated or victorious ( no trigger applied) one or 2 of them will turn around and head back for the battlefield.

I have tried different tricks or tactics to solve the problem; changed the units positions, script, added triggers nothing works.This happens in various different scenarios with different tanks or spgs...Any idea???( short of court-martialling them)

Have you looked into their morale settings? 100% is the default, but I've seen some hiccups where it's set as zero,

[frinik]

  Can't be the problem I systematically set experience and morale at max when I create my own stuff and even games by others I edit them to have the settings at max as well...

[Rends]

frinik.
Please post your Script file of the mission. Maybe there is something wrong.

[hemisent]

1. My infantry units are placed in trenches facing their correct direction. As soon as firing starts they all get up and go running around instead of staying in the trenches. How do I keep the infantry in the trenches?

You'll have to select the 'stay in trench' option in the divisions tab. The icon with the blue 'down arrow'.

   Initially I had the outline as a single line with multiple points placed exactly on/over the trench position (open ended) and I have the "Stay in trench" button activated. The mission starts (in the ME---very cool) and the infantry begin in the trench and jumps up and they all take off. I then reconfigured the contour to encompass the trench area and closed the contour, now the infantry starts in the general area but still takes off.  This is happening upon mission start when there is no threat.