Graviteam

OK. Now, thanks to some good guys, we've a possibility to check Jagdpanzer in the battle ;)
The mission-mod: Ugly Duckling (JP IV) presents a new units: Jagdpanzer IV, Pz IV H (schyrzen).
The mission was made on the NTA 1.3. base and polygon Sokolovo. There's only one variant of installation: full.
As usually, full variant made on the base as “INSTALL-PLAY-UNINSTALL”. So, BE WARNING, that when the mission has finished - don't forget to UNINSTALL it or use it at your risk.
Download (http://www.4shared.com/rar/8ntW4luU/Ugly_duckling_12.html). Weight: ~56Mb

(http://s5.postimage.org/kgq6liro3/jagdpanzer.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/kgq6liro3/)
(http://xmages.net/storage/10/1/0/e/1/thumb/thumb_d5ec0ec1.jpg) (http://xmages.net/view.php/93820)   (http://xmages.net/storage/10/1/0/e/4/thumb/thumb_96d60582.jpg) (http://xmages.net/view.php/93824)   (http://xmages.net/storage/10/1/0/e/4/thumb/thumb_b6bdbcf0.jpg) (http://xmages.net/view.php/93826)   (http://xmages.net/storage/10/1/0/1/2/thumb/thumb_056a62ee.jpg) (http://xmages.net/view.php/93827)   (http://xmages.net/storage/10/1/0/0/d/thumb/thumb_f13c7391.jpg) (http://xmages.net/view.php/93825)   (http://xmages.net/storage/10/1/0/9/8/thumb/thumb_1801eef1.jpg) (http://xmages.net/view.php/93822)   (http://xmages.net/storage/10/1/0/4/d/thumb/thumb_e3280d4c.jpg) (http://xmages.net/view.php/93823)   (http://xmages.net/storage/10/1/0/2/9/thumb/thumb_6e86af7a.jpg) (http://xmages.net/view.php/93821)

Recommended installation order (through JSGME.exe):
1. SPM 1.5beta+fix 1.5 beta
2. SPM1.5 NTA1.3
3. Mission: A miracle-weapon Jagdtiger
4. Mission: Destroy Airfield
5. Mission: Ugly Duckling

Credits:
- SF authors
- SPM 1.5 team
- Donken (Jagdpanzer IV modeling, scripting)
- SHUN (Jagdpanzer IV adjusting, compilation)
- Maleshkin (Jagdpanzer IV textures)
- Mistwalker/Donken (Pz IVH (schyrzen modeling, scripting)

ps
I can win only at the balance "2" :D

Just wanted to say thanks for the new models.  The JagdpanzerIV and the Panzer IVH are both great.  Really well done.  They both are a lot of fun to play ;D

Edward

Did some1 manage to finish mission on the balance "5"(enemy experience "3")? ;) Comrade SVN did it, mostly all screenies from his mission.

I tried, but I was not able to finish it with balace "5"... impossible for me  :-\

What about gunsight damaging on Jagdpanzer? Can some1 confirm that damaging decreased drastically by ~90%?

I must say that having played the jagdpanzer in both your mission and test ones no gun damage to report so far!Well done Lockie!Hope the same technique can be applied to all the tanks?

Same results here... in my testing I have got no gunsight damage in the jaddpanzer IV. Seems to be working properly  :)

Txema

Good to hear it! So, the problem vs gunsight damaging is resolved. Suppose, appropriate fixes will be applied to the new update NTA 1.5.

Lockie
 The game plays out beautifully. The only complaint I have is the MG's do not fire. This was a problem with the model from when it was introduced(at least for me). Both my Jagdtiger and Jagdpanzer refuse to fire their machine guns, other than that I have no negative issues.

 Great work!

Cheers
H

Hemi check your tech_cfg file for the Jagdtiger does it look like that for the weapons and shells entries?



   //îðóæèå
   weapons()
   {
      //íàçâàíèå, ÷àíê âûëåòà, ÷àíê îòêàòà, áàøíÿ èç êîòîðîé ñòðåëÿþò, ðàáî÷åå ìåñòî çàðÿæàþùåãî
      PAK44, s_gun, db_gun,    head1, wp_loader,s_klin, 0.1, 0, 1, 0;                                                         
                         MG34,  s_mgun, ,       head2, wp_mgunner;
               

   }

   //áîåêîìïëåêò
   shells()
   {

      PZGR39_44, 25, 0, 0;         
      SPRGR_44, 15, 0, 1;

        BUL_792, 2925;

Hi Frinik
 just compared the tech_cfg files and they're identical. The mg's should fire with the right mouse button right? Is there something in-game that activates or ok's their use? this is the reason I don't use either of  these units.

Thanks
H

Well, I don't know. I always shoot from MG by pressing "Enter". Jagpanzer has only one MG and if u want to shoot from MG, u've to take place of loader(F4).

No they should not, neither of the Jagdpanzer or Jagdtiger have coax mg:s. Only hull mg:s used by other crewmembers, same as Stug and Jagdpanther. Not many tankdestroyers had coax mg:s, its mostly a tank/turret vehicle attribute.

Donken
 I must have missed it somewhere where the player must occupy the loader position to fire the machine gun. I just tried it and it works pressing the "enter" key. Not too thrilled with the tiny mg sight but at least I have a way of defending against infantry.  Thank you.

H

if you hit backspace it makes the sight bigger.

The back space wroks for all gun sights as well.For the Tiger II and Jagdpanther you have 2 magnifications; the default one and if you want it smaller then just press page down.

I have chnaged the magnification values for the JP and Tiger II and Elefant in the common res from 9,5,5 to 18,2.5.2.5 .I find the smaller magnification gives better accuracy when targetting and hitting tanks and vehicles.

frinik: Or in the future you can experiment with the aiming speed instead, It is these numbers, You find them in xxx.engcfg under heads() section

      //name, chunk of the head, chunk gun
      //angle to the left - right angle up - down
      //speed of rotation on the horizontal - vertical - / / - for electric drive (deg / sec)
      
      head1, s_rotation_01, db_gunmask,      10, 10,  10, 5,   17, 12, 12, 8;

So 17(up/down), 12(left/right) is the speed for the "fast" aiming (when pressing down ctrl and moves) and standard speed is 12, 8.

Donken I am not sure I am following you when you say "fast aiming"????Do you mean increasing the rotation of the turret ? Already I find that for some tanks the rotation speed seems to be much faster than real values?

You have two different ways to rotate your gun/turret. One normal way using mouse or arrowbuttons on your keyboard. That is the usual way. But you can also hold control button and move with your keyboard and the turret/gun move alot faster (on the tanks with different numbers in their .engcfg file). So if you change those bold numbers in my other post to a lower number the aiming should be alot slower depending on how much you change it.

So in a other way this could help with your "inaccurate moving to fast" aiming when the sight is zoomed. Instead of changing the real values for the sights (cheating) ;)

Ahh Ok ! I undertsand what youare talking about.Actually what i do to move the turret is use the up, down right and left arrow keys rather than the mouse which i consider too arcadish( OK for fps but not for sims).

Re the magnification I did not explain myself well.I find the magnification to be too big for me to properly estimate the disatance to the target because in tanks/SPGs with a single rectangle like the Tiger II, Jagdpanther, Jagdpanzer , Stugs, Elefant and the Panzer III and IV I don't use the calibration.No I love using my eyesight to elevate /raise the gun to aim and hiot the target merely through my distance-estimations skills.I have a pretty good eye for thta and I am able to quickly estimate how much I shoulkd raise the gun to hit the target accurately withotu using the distance gradings.So instead of " chaeting": I am in fatc making my gunning skills more challenging and difficult.However I need to decrease the magnification use the eye method. So technically I am nto cheating unless you want to call making targetting more difficult for the user cheating... ;D

BTW I did the same with yoru Jagdtiger.Now I can hit targets by eye with 80% accuracy or more...With the JP and Tiger II I am at 95%.

OK everything sounds great! But dear Frinik, where is conquering of the balance 10? ;)
OK, let it be balance 6 :D

Oh but Lockie that's the all point; not only is the balance set at 10 but hitting targets is even more difficult with the optics reduced by 50% magnification.So it's even tougher!Seriously you ought to try it at balance 51

It has been accustomed for me to using a "direct shot" during aiming. It's much easy and comfortable, imho.

Lockie it's becasue I have been trying to recreate how WWII gunners had to do it. Aiming even using the scales was a guessing game at best since they did not have range finders(The Germans had some ready for deployment but in April 1945 too late to be put into the field).So the gunner and commander had to use their experience and eyesight

Hello Frinik, hello Lockie,

There is much useful information on range calculations in the Pantherfibel and Tigerfibel. These German tank manuals are available online. They present detailed instructions on how to use the triangle divisions (or "teeth") on the gun sight and the known dimensions of enemy vehicles to determine range and lead. However, these methods involve calculating fractions at lightning speed.  ;) Math is not one of my strength, so I really just guess and shoot by eye.  :)
Nonetheless, in his memoir of service on the Eastern Front, Canadian-born tank gunner Bruno Friesen, who served on the Pz IV and Jagdpanzer IV, described in detail how he used the range calculation methods outlined in the Panther- and Tigerfibel in combat. Friesen's memoir "Panzergunner" is available in English, including translations of parts of the Panther- and Tigerfibel.

Cheers,

FW

HI FW good to hear from you!

I use the scales with the Tiger I's tfz12 and the Panther D's as well because they have both triangle and a line below and this makes it easy but those that simply have a trinagle in the middle I find my brain and eyesight faster than actually tinkering with the scales....

I have both fibels in the original German version.Interesting especially the cartoons.Rather unGerman in the humouristical approach....

Hi Frinik,

Is that not a rather common misconception in the English-speaking world, that Germans have little to no sense of humor?  :) Instruction manuals for fighter pilots were done very similar to the Panther- and Tigerfibel, with funny cartoons and rhymes, etc.


Cheers,

FW

Well, Germans are often stereotyped as arrogant, inflexible and humourless and not only by the Anglo-Saxons but also by the French, Italians etc.Although being half German myself( Prussian in fact) I have a keen sense of humour and I think Germans are given worse press on that score than they deserve.But growing up partly in Switzerland I found Swiss Germans to conform more to the stereotypes ascribed to the Germans than the Germans themselves ;D

Woah, Almost all Germans ive been talking to have been very very funny, Lots of nice humor :D

As I said the Germans are given worse press than they deserve.Look at Arnold Schwarzenegger( I know he is originally Austrian but they are part fo the German people as far as I am concerned) he 's got quite a sense of humour in all his films.... ;D

Alright Folks,

Let's bash the Swiss then...  ;) However, all of the (admittedly few) people from Switzerland whom I have met, are hilarious. As Frinik said, it's more a matter of stereotyping than anything else. Having grown up in Germany, I remember that the local stereotype there was that the British had no sense of humor, something that I found proven incorrect, at least in the case of my British friends. The list goes on and on. The Sioux (Lakota) and other Native American/Aboriginal peoples were often described as utterly humorless by people of European descent. Nonetheless, most of the Lakota and other Native people I know have a very keen sense of humor. The same goes for my Korean in-laws, my Mongolian and Japanese friends, etc, etc. Once one gets to know a person from another country, or another cultural background, some of these stereotypes are corrected, or at least put into perspective. That's why I like forums and communities like this one, because they bring together people from around the globe, who share a common interest, but not necessarily the same cultural background and yet can have a meaningful and positive exchange.
Anyway, it's been a long day at work and I guess I must be in a very non-confrontational mood. Just too tired...  :)

Cheers,

FW

Me too I am in a totally non confrontational mood and I hate stereotyping...just wish the Russians and Ukrainians had a sense of humour that's all!And the Swiss Germans would speak proper German ;D