Graviteam

VERSION 1.0 [Final] RELEASED
Hello,

First off, I'd like to say that there's no possible way to relay my gratitude to the modders who selflessly released SPM 1.5 ultimate update. Secondly, I'd like to say that the Panzer III and Panzer IV skins horrified me to no end, so I've fixed them (in my mind, atleast). The following are based off the Summer of 1943 scheme used by the Germans at Kursk, and Soviet tanks from 1943 to the end of the war. 

These are included in version 1.0:
GERMANY
-Panzer III
-Panzer IV
-Panzer IV H (tan)
-Panzer IV H (tricolor)
-Panzer II
-Marder III
-Marder II (131)
-Sdkfz. 251c
-Sdkfz. 251/10c
-Sdkfz. 250
-Sdkfz. 232
-Opel Blitz

USSR
-JS-122
-KV-1a
-KV-1s

DOWNLOAD
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mxcxgifyd53q254

PATCH for Panzer IV H tricolor
http://www.mediafire.com/?ezw5tpocnpscr5t

PATCH for Sdkfz. 251 without 11th Pz. Div. insignia's
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?3le7u47enyvpc4a

Panzer IV F2 patch
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?l4q47415lvov8zo

Panzer VI Tiger Ausf E
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?bc127vu1x83bya1

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_13_51_00_0000.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_13_47_54_0002.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_13_47_48_0001.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_13_43_08_0008.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_13_40_36_0004.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_13_39_52_0003.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_13_39_17_0002.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_13_20_27_0000.jpg)
(note: I didn't make this one. I just overwrote the other Tiger skins (except SS) with it.)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_01_21_13_0001.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_01_20_28_0000.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_01_18_11_0000.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_14_03_14_0000.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_14_05_26_0000.jpg)

EDIT:
New, up to date skins have been added and old ones removed :)

Now that I look at these, not all of them are up to date either  :-X Rest assured, the weapons for the Panzer II aren't camouflaged, the stripe on the KV cheesy looking, nor the MG-34 painted green or tan for any of the finished vehicles. It's 2 am though, so I'll post them tomorrow
 

Problem = solved ;D

Now we're just waiting on the permission to use Aces' work and the release will be good. any and all feedback is welcomed, especially from Kyth's prying eyes.

Up next:
IDF Mod for SABOW (2.0)
1943-1944 Winter Mod (improved Winter Skins for use with Stone 2009's Winter Mod)  [I'll probably end up doing this one while working with the SABOW mod]

Looking very good Whukid! I , for one, am not a fan of the Feldgrau colour .I love the German mid to late war camos!Looking forward to it!

Excellent, I've been waiting for something like this! :)
Have you perhaps considered doing some yellow base/brown camo or yellow base/brown & green camo schemes?

I could only find Yellow & Green schemes. If you could find a few of the Yellow & Brown and Yellow/Green/Brown pictures then sure! I believe most of the tricolor schemes were used against the Anglo-Americans in the West though

Well, I'm not sure of the type of camouflage prevalent on the West or East front, but afaik the crews were issued green and brown paint to paint their own patterns over the yellow base, and I don't see why the tankers in the East wouldn't receive both. I'll PM you in a few. :)

Panzer IV Ausf H

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_16_51_01_0005.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_16_51_13_0007.jpg)

And a much cooler picture of the Panzer IV Ausf F2

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_16_46_45_0003.jpg)

I like the way the IVH is looking, but I have a minor observation, if I may: the green paint seems rather plentiful - maybe it'd be better if it was applied more sparingly, along with the choco-braun, on the base paint? :)

Pz II, III, IVF, Marder and APC's are looking good.

I also have Pz IV H skin without camo - completely yellow if there's a need for it: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?70y1znt9pzc7npn.
 I see you're still using the older version of the Pz IV H model - it has some UV seams on screens and still bears the name "shyrzen", which it shouldn't have (Pz IV H is just Pz IV H).

The main problem about creating camo for Pz IV H is:  UVs from the different elements in the same place (you prolly could notice that yourself - check how the red paint appeared on the inner side of the hatches)  and also element borders (this is when camo pattern on the roof doesn't match with the pattern on the sides for example). So creating of Pz IV H camo while keeping such mistakes to a minimum is a long and painful process, even having 3d model.  :(

Now about white stripes on the turrets - they were needed to avoid friendly fire from the allied aviation in the last 3 months of war.
And by that time KV-1s were a very rare sight, and KV-1 not even on the front line anymore.

THANK YOU SO MUCH.

I will agree with you on that second part. Alot of the UV maps for the most recent tanks seem to be pretty squished together.

EDIT:
Are you sure about the White Stripe recognition thing? From what I understand, they were in use at Kursk for some vehicles.

Two versions will be available upon release. One with a Beige-tan Panzer IV H and one with a Tri-color scheme.

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_19_20_05_0000.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_19_20_19_0001.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_20_37_22_0000.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_20_37_29_0001.jpg)

The camo already looks 100% better than previous efforts.  ;D

A couple of comments:

- The 'air recognition stripes' are of a pattern used in the last few Soviet offensives. I think at Kursk they used stripes or geometric patterns on their turret roofs. They were brush-painted, so they should have hard edges.

- The Panzer IVH camo is good and random and good enough as a final version. However as a matter of personal taste, those 'islands' of brown and green shouldn't touch each other, they should be separated at a consistent distance, more or less. Just my opinion,

Thanks,

Marder II (131)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_21_33_32_0001.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_27_21_33_12_0000.jpg)

And now, for the release;

VERSION 1.0 [Final]
http://www.mediafire.com/?mxcxgifyd53q254

Install instructions are in the readme files.

Thanks to Aces for the 3D fixed Sdfkz 251 V2, and to Mistwalker for the Panzer IV H template.

ENJOY ;D

EDIT:
gahhh sorry kyth :P I didn't see your reply in time :(

PATCH
Drop this into the textures/tanks/mediums folder

http://www.mediafire.com/?ezw5tpocnpscr5t

Inaccuracy = fixed :)

Wow, that's quick,  :)

It wasn't really a big problem :P I just re-made the "Brown" layer in the template to fix the problem and compressed/released it :)

PATCH2
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?3le7u47enyvpc4a

Sdkfz. 251 without 11th Panzer Division markings

Mmm, loving the tri-color Pz IVH :) And the regular tan one looks excellent as well, I can see already it'll be a difficult choice to make.

Great work mate looks absolutely splendid!.

Kind regards

Aces

They were, but not very often, and they were much thinner:

(http://waralbum.ru/wp-content/uploads/yapb_cache/kv_1_s_19431.8f59if0xsfksgowckk0kk0kgo.ejcuplo1l0oo0sk8c40s8osc4.th.jpeg)
(http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/kv1s/kv1s_67.jpg)
(http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/kv1s/kv1s_62.jpg)


PS: Just realized that the photo somehow reminds me of a SF screenshot in Grayscale. Should play less often. ;D

Great work !!!

Ah, I see! I will release a patch for that shortly. I personally hate modding the skin for russian tanks; I can't ever find the parts I need to edit  ??? !

Anyways, thanks so much SF community for the support!

Just as a little source of laughter; the 1st patch has twice as many downloads as the mod itself.

Whukid,

First of all, thank you very much for all your work on this very nice mod !!

Let me ask a quick question: is it necessary to install "Aces SdkFz251 3D Model, Crew and Texture Mod v2.rar" prior to your mod?

I am asking it because you are giving credits to it in your previous post...


Txema

Nope :) It works just fine without it

Whukid would it be possible to use some of your skins for the Tiger II???This poor tank is in dire need of new ones.The current one ain't bad but it could be better.

mmm I can try. The problem with the Tiger II skin is that its tricolor scheme is impregnable unless I can get my hands on a multilayer template

Okay, I've decided to move the Russian tanks over to my next update "Summer Skins 1944". I hope to include a bunch of the later tanks, like Tiger 1, Tiger 2, Jagdpanther, Jagdtiger, T-44, and SU-152. It's by no means limited to those tanks, but they're most likely going to be included.

To Frinik, I'm slogging my way through creating a template for Tiger 2. I expect cookies.
(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/GIMP1.jpg)

Hi,

About the skin template. You could use '3D ripper' to extract the 3D model. From there, you could import the model into something like Blender (yes the famous Blender again  :)) which you could use to export the UV map into a tga or png image file. All the outlines and shapes will be drawn out for you.
Another good thing about Blender: you can use it to check which part of the skin goes where on the model.

---

Anyway, if you want to stick with Gimp,
The surest way to draw perfect circles:
Select ellipse (drag it into a circle shape, check the status bar for the dimensions) -> Choose 'Selection to path' -> In the 'Paths' tab use 'Stroke path' (either a solid colour or some other brush pattern).

Thanks Kyth! I have no clue how to use blender, but what the hell; I'll give it a shot.

What do you want to change in SU-152 skin? IMO the newer version of the model is fine the way it is: http://www.sukhoi.ru/forum/showthread.php?t=52890&p=1809124&viewfull=1#post1809124

By the way, I have tiger 2 model, so I can supply you with both UV map and the model itself.
Just keep in mind that it's summer production model, so it should have zimmerit coating.

And don't forget to use late Tiger model for late skin.
I also have the texture without camo and zimmerit for it. ;)

Thanks! I don't really have a set roster yet :P I also have no idea what schemes most of the German-Soviet tanks used in the summer of 1944. 'tis why god made google ;)

I'm compiling pictures for the Late War schemes, and so far this is what I've found. I decided that there are too few 1944-only paint schemes. Any thoughts?

(http://www.onthewaymodels.com/reviews/RevellAG/graphics/mhatchLateTiger1Eleft10.jpg)

(http://static.hlj.com/images/dra/dra60054.jpg)

(http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTWtqWwi6gS-WBqYG7_RkpH9Suut_EQnoHb12PvNg9w4Fbkj3oEDIaSu8ho)

(http://www.madaxeman.com/gallery/albums/uploads/PICT0119.JPG)

(http://www.justkitsandmodels.co.uk/largeimage2/242512IT-7030_L1.jpg)

Surprisingly, there aren't many color schemes to chose from. I might just end up picking from the selection that the "Theatre of War: Kursk" and "Theatre of War" have to offer.

Well, afaik the Germans never really had a standardised camouflage pattern, until Ambush in late 44 (an interesting custom skin for WoT which sums up the gist of it http://www1.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/2e8ed25b9d3166f859235c35f83811bd52480038ad29ea4ccc9f087dfdfd59ec6g.jpg). You are pretty much free to go wild with any tricolor camo patterns you find and think are nice, as it's all but impossible to prove that a certain tank crew in a certain theatre DIDN'T paint their tank that way. :) (that is, unless you want to go the extra mile and find specific colour camo schemes of tanks which were known to have served in the area of operations you'd like to depict, of course)
Imho, you should experiment with weathering, such as chipped and faded paint, scratches, mud & dirt in order to make your chosen camo patterns look even better. A good example of what I mean by weathering are Slayerknecht's custom CoH tank skins, which you can check out the ModDB page of his Arnhem 44 mod (my favourite is the King Tiger :D ) :

http://www.moddb.com/mods/pegasus/images/jagdpanzer-iv#imagebox
http://www.moddb.com/mods/pegasus/images/sdkfz-250n#imagebox
http://www.moddb.com/mods/pegasus/images/panzer-v-variations#imagebox
http://www.moddb.com/mods/pegasus/images/panzer-iv-ausf-h#imagebox
http://www.moddb.com/mods/pegasus/images/henschel-knigstiger#imagebox

Edit:
And perhaps for even more variation, some low poly custom models of branches and bushels could be created, that could be attached to existing tank models, as was common in the later war period.

Thanks, but unfortunately those are all Western Front schemes :( I don't believe they are interchangeable with the camo used in the East

But how can you discern the two if the actual camouflaging was done by the crews, using the same paints? :)
Or are you intent on creating skins of actual vehicles used on the Eastern front?

I personally have no dispositions :P I feel that not too many people would be interested if I were to create a bunch of Western Front skins, since they would be fighting the Russians

I would hardly mind, but if you'd prefer actual Ostfront refs, I'll see what I can dig up. :)

If you could, that'd be much appreciated. :)

Just checked the patch myself.  Pz. 2 and APC's are great, Pz. 4 H, Pz. 3 and Marder are very good, except a few small UV mapping issues.
Pz IV F has some noticeable UV problems. And too much green color in my opinion.

The tanks below definitely need their new skins fixed or just removed completely - there isn't many changes those skins make after all.

Some UV maping problems:
(http://s9.postimage.org/othjsh28v/tank1.jpg) (http://postimage.org/)

Same here.
(http://s14.postimage.org/3sgt17fqp/tank3.jpg) (http://postimage.org/)

Late tiger suffered most of all - commander's cupola, ventilator, mortar hatch, turret ring, fire extinguisher, some small elements.
And what happened to the wheels?  :o
(http://s18.postimage.org/jfle0lgt5/tank2.jpg) (http://postimage.org/)

I cannot my way around Russian tanks to save my life  >:( You'll also notice that the KV-1 doesn't have white paint on the gun mantle. I meant to get rid of them before uploading, but I was occupied by the Marder and Panzer IV H.

As for the Tiger, I merely renamed the beige "Tiger" skin to replace the other, mottled, skin. I didn't really touch it

Alas, these will be fixed! 

It might be worth re-doing the Jpz IV skin, which is quite rancid.
And frankly, the Panther A deserves something better, too.  :(

Nooooooooooooo I like the Panther A skin! It reminds me of Harlequin' s costume ;D

I suddenly remembered another pet peeve of mine - the captured "wehrmacht trophy" T-34 isn't likely to be sporting such an elaborate 3-colour camo. For expediency, they'd be painted with big black crosses, for quick identification.

IMHO, SPM 1.4 got it right.
The skin with SPM 1.5 'improved it worse'.  :o

Jeez. Whoever came up with the Tiger [late] and the normal Tiger skins is on my shit list. The differences were so minuscule and hard to find it wasn't even funny. -_________-

I plan on re-working all the German skins for the next edition though. it might take alittle time, as I'm still working on releasing the IDF mod 2.0

You have done a great job so far whukid. I do have lots of the german tanks from SF in 3dsmax and if you want i can give you the uvw maps of them (black background with green outlines) perfect to add as an layer to your textures to see all parts for example.
I have: Jagdtiger, Jagdpanzer, Jagdpanther, Kingtiger, Tiger (dont know which version thou), Pz4 including H, Pz2 Luchs and the russian Su-76 (that ones definitely needs a higher res texture) and i also got a Panther model but i dont know who made it or which model it is igm.

If I could snatch the Jagdpanther, King Tiger, and the Panther one, I'd much appreciate it :)

The only two models in game are the Ausf D and the Ausf A. The easiest way to tell them apart ( in my mind) is the bow machinegun in the Ausf A model :) Ausf D never had a machinegun on the bow mount for some reason

Hmm, actually. The Jagdpanther i have is the newer one with textures taken from WoT, they are pretty good already, but do you still want it? And about the Panther. I think i have the one banned because of the copyright stuff (taken from Forgotten Hope 2) I did see that first now, Sorry for that :D But is any of the Panthers igm made from that one? Do you still need the uvw map for it?
And the Kingtiger. I dont know if Mistwalker have changed anything on the uvw map after i got the model from him to he released it in the UU patch. But i dont think he did so much. So atleast you can have that template right away :D

Kingtiger Template (http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?4pydpehhj64m6a3)

Sure, I'll take the Jagdpanther! I don't believe the Panthers in game used the Forgotten hope template :-\ Thanks for the KT template !

well, sry, cant give you Jagpanther either xD The uvw map is a complete mess on the original one (the model needs an almost complete redoing) So its nothing you can work with :( So you need to wait for my updated Jagdpanther which i btw can try to finalize and release, after that you can have a nice good clean uvw-map :D Oh god, feels like i gave you more problems then i helped haha ::)

it's all good :) If you could, would it be possible to include a multilayer template for the Jagdpanther? It's practically impossible to work with the standard .DDS files unless it came in a standard color, like Grey.

well, i dont really know what exactly you mean. But adding layers, for example adding the uv-map to your texture file as a background layer is something you do in your program. You also change greyscale and other stuff like that in it. Kyth can probably explain how to do :D

And here btw is the uv-map mess on the Jagdpanther!

(http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/660/jagdpantheruvmess.th.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/543/jagdpantheruvmess.jpg/)

He means that he can supply you with the green outlines and shapes that represent the unwrapped 3D model, i.e. the bare necessities.
From there, in Gimp, you'll have to add in the additional layers, for example, the surface details like panel lines and rivets, surface textures, base colour and shading. The surface details can be obtained from scale plans, or from the original skin. Textures can be downloaded from the net.
From all that, you'll get a proper template. A rather painstaking process, but it's worth it when it's done right,

ps. remember my tip about drawing perfect circles in Gimp, you'll need it a lot.

You shouldn't do that, because late Tiger and early Tiger model are slightly different and UV mapping doesn't match in some places. I have a plain yellow skin for the late tiger so I'll upload it too.

As to the russian tanks - It's best of all to paint stripes  in software that allows 3d-painting like Maya or Z-Brush. This way you can almost avoid UV-mapping problems. Late Tiger and default Pz. IV skins are painted that way. If you'll look at them, you'll notice that camo stripes and spots are seamless almost everywhere.

And I recommend to use the skins from the latest Ultimate Update patch for editing. IS-2 texture there for example is slightly different from what you have.

It's almost the same, but I've changed 2 small elements actually. You can see what exactly was changed looking at the latest UV Template:
http://www.mediafire.com/imageview.php?quickkey=tvk67pdhqlcomtw (http://www.mediafire.com/imageview.php?quickkey=tvk67pdhqlcomtw)

Well, I took a break from modding today. Look what I made! ;D I call it, "Streetfight in Berlin"

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/StreetfightinBerlin-1.jpg)

RENDERED in GIMP
 (http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/StreetfightinBerlin2.jpg)

What a talent! You ought to work as war correspondent! CNN, BBC anybody for Whukid????

Did the Stug take the JS-2 out????BTW there were 2 Tiger 2 taking part in that last battle before the last( the last battle was Prague in May ).They destroyed something like 50 Sov tanks before running out of ammo.

The Soviets lost almost a thousand tanks in the battle for Berlin. I think it's safe to say a few might've been knocked out by Stug's :P
 nevermind! I misread what you meant. Yea, the Stug zapped the IS-2 before being knocked out or overrun by infantry

I'm not really sure what to do with my drawings. I guess I could try to make a living out of it, but I'd rather keep it as a hobby.

Most of tanks they lost were to panzerfausts/panzerschrecks or mines.The Germans had little armour left.

BTW it's not Forgotten Hope ( my mistake)the Panther G was modded for it's for Darkest Hour the R.O mod. In fatc oyu can see the model in a video on youtube

well, just incase you're wondering, the wounded guy on the left is supposed to be a surviving crew member :P

Is the German soldier on the right firing a Sturmgewehr 1944?

He should be, but to me the shape and colouring is somehow more reminiscent of an AK-47. Nice drawing, nonetheless!

Thanks guys :)

Yea, he has a Sturmgewehr. I couldn't remember any defining characteristics about it except that it had a skinnier magazine and a different upper receiver than the AK-47.

The IS-2 is a post-war version.   ;D


Permanent losses during battle in the city itself were following:

2nd Guards Tank Army lost 104 armored vehicles (4 IS 2)
3rd Guards Tank Army lost 114 armored vehicles (no more than 2 IS 2)
4th Guards Tank Army lost 46 armored vehicles (1 IS 2)

11 Tank Corps of 5th Shock Army lost 77, 1st Guards Tank Army lost 232, and 7th heavy tank brigade lost 39 armored vehicles  during entire Berlin operation (so we can safely assume that no more than half of all vehicles were lost in the batle for the city itself).

That gives us about 450 destroyed vehicles in the city at max.

I am not surprised considering the street battles and the fact that most of Berlin was in rubbles after the heavy Allied bombings of 1944 and early 1945.There were probably very few streets or avenues that were still possible for the armour to use.Plus Soviet tankers would be very much aware that in a urban warfare context tanks are very vulnerable to ambushes or traps. I suspect that probably 80 % of Soviet armour losses in the city proper were due to hand-held AT weapons.. I remember reading an article about a French Waffen SS volunteer in the Charlemagne division who destroyed 13 Soviet tanks with panzerfausts in a week and was awarded the Iron Cross....

Aaaand here is the  texture for the late Tiger in .PSD format.

http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?n6m69tq6jr89x11


About 2/3 AFAIR. Tank is a good weapon in the city if you have a proper infantry support.

Hmm. According to Will Fey's "Panzer Battles of the Waffen SS", over 800 tanks were knocked out by Hitlerjugen the German army in Berlin. The quote from his book is "Marshal Konev wrote in his memoirs that the Soviets lost 800 tanks in the fight for Berlin, equivalent to four or five tank divisions" According to the records of the 503rd, eight King tigers knocked out over 480 tanks in 12 days

The difference between knocked out and destroyed tank is that knocked out tank can be repaired. How fast - depends on damage. It can just lose track or wheel for example and be abandoned by crew (or have some crewmembers killed) but next hour it'll be in combat again. Some damaged tanks required days to repair, some required factory mainteance but that's temporary losses.

So if you read somewhere about "we knocked out/destroyed 100 tanks" and you want to know, how many tanks the enemy lost permanently, you can without much worries cut the number at least in half.
This is true for both sides. I've read in the books a number of reports where Soviet troops claimed insanely huge number of kills, but according to the German reports actual losses were low. That doesn't mean the other side was lying in all cases, more like it means how effective German repair service was. Add miscalculations here (like a few sources reporting about the same kill independently) and you'll get the number. Also if you'll look at German claims and actual permanent losses from the Soviet side, you'll see that in many cases the second number doesn't even stand near the first.

As to the batlle for Berlin - Konev mentioned the real number of permanent losses for the 1-st Ukrainian Front, but he meant the entire Berlin operation from April 16th to May 5th at almost 400 km length. During that time the front participated in Halbe encirclement for example, where about 80000 of German troops were trapped (more than 150000 including rear lines). And this is more than the entire force that defended the city.

I agree.The loss claims were dubious since there was a tendency to inflate numbers on both sides for propaganda purposes.Sometimes alos the same tank could be hit by 2 different tanks or a tank and an At gun for example  and be claimed as 2 tanks destroyed.The sam ething happened with air losses and air battles.

One good example is the Allies pilots claims as to the number of German tanks they destroyed during the Normandy battle.The maount of losses thye claim exceeded the number of tanks the Germans had on the entire Western front. I remember reading that comparing the ,losses thye pilots had claimed with Germna records of their own destroyed amrour losses after the wear and the pilots claims had been exaggerated by up to 80%.In fatc while pilots had claimed 60% of all German amrour destroyed the actual rate after the war was found to be closer to 5%.

Likewise the Sobviets claimed having destroyed more Tiger tanks during the Kursk battle than the Germans had actually fielded.Likewise the German Panzeraces claims of their kills look highly inflated in many instances.The only accurately way you can verify the  enemy's casualties are when you remain master of the battlefield and can actually count the enemy tank wrecks left behind...

Knocked out meant out of combat , disabled. Destroyed is really what counts.

In their losses the Soviets include tanks that were destroyed accidentally by their own troops( according to articles I read the Soviet had an incredibly high rate of accidents dues to drunkenness and carelessness from recruits or unsufficiently trained crews. 3 to 4 times higher than the Germans. So of the 800 tanks lost by the Soviets may be 15 % were lost to accidents not to mention friendly fire.

As for the 8 Tiger IIs destroying 480 tanks in 12 days it's possible but probably exaggerated considering low ammo and fuel supplies and the German being on the retreat constantly....

I'm not so sure. Of course there is the very likely possibility that those tanks weren't to terribly damaged (this was more common on the western front, from what I gather. one battalion had a loss rate of 588%, but repaired all but 15 of their tanks),  however the Germans had one of the strictest "kill claim" criteria. The Russian government also isn't exactly the best source of information. Even in modern times (Chechnya), they refuse to acknowledge the true casualty figures, favoring numbers far less than the reality.

Another reason I'm skeptical of the Red Army reports is a simple one; Willi Fey was a tank commander in the Berlin sector. True, he may be biased, however he has a first hand experience in the fighting raging around Berlin. Unfortunately, I highly doubt the NKVD commanders who "edited" the Red Army reports had the same intentions in mind.

Lastly, lets also keep in mind that my original statement was " The russians lost almost a thousand tanks in the battle for Berlin." The distinction between "knocked out" and "destroyed" is fairly irrelevant, since the armored vehicles were still knocked out of commission, their crews either dead or abandoned. From what I understand, the knocked out vehicles were unable to be repaired for days at a time because the area was still contested by the Germans.

Please excuse my skepticism of the Russians; it's the old Cold War rivalry acting up ;D

Now, for some mod news;

I'm currently in the process of adding tanks to the IDF mod 2.0. When I'm done figuring that out or when I get frustrated (whichever comes first), I'll return to the Steel Fury skins. In the mean time, I hope to fix a few things, like the Panzer IV F2 paint and the Tiger. Stock skins for the edited russian tanks will be supplied shortly. :) It's recommended that the user overwrite their "KV-1a/s" and "IS-2" entries with the SP1.5 skins or just plain delete them.

Also, some little bastard hacked into my Mediafire account. 59 editions of the new "IDF mod 1.75 Beta" were leaked, somewhere.  >:( Retribution shall be swift..

Panzer IV F2 patch
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?l4q47415lvov8zo

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_31_23_37_49_0000.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_05_31_23_37_55_0001.jpg)

Panzer VI Tiger Ausf E
http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?bc127vu1x83bya1

Thanks, and remember also to patch the Jpz IV skin, which is rather rancid, IMHO,  :)

Haha all things in good time, Kyth :P It'll be included in the 1944-1945 Skin update, as will the Panther Ausf A/D, Tiger 1 (late), Tiger 2(503rd Pz Btn colors, no insignia), Jagdtiger (kudos to KapulA for the reference), Jagdpanther, Hetzer, Panzer IV Ausf H, Stug III F/G, Panzer III, and the Ferdinand.

These patches were for the last update. I didn't quite have everything perfect, and I'm trying to fix em up alittle :P 

Whukid, is it possible to use your new skins selectively?I.e I happen to like the current Panther Ausf.A tri-colour camo as well as the Tiger SS and late war Tiger I tri-colour camo that came with the Ultimate release.Even the Panzer IV H one ain't bad.So I'd like to have some of the new ones and retain some of the old ones.....

Re German tank kills.While it's true the Germans had a very strict kills claim system let's not forget that starting mid 1943 they were continuously on the retreat and rarely able to tally the claimed kills with actually kills left by the enemy on the battlefield.Plus The Nazis, like the Soviets, were a totalitarian party which had a very active propaganda service and I am sure Docktor Goebbels - the one who invented the dictum " the bigger the lie the more likely it is going to to believed or accepted eventually as the truth" - would not have been against inflating the number of kills in order to boost the morale on the homefront....

I think all you would need to do is delete the  appropriate dds file  in H:\Steel Fury - Kharkov 1942\MODS\Whukid's Kursk Skin pack (tricolor)\data\k42\loc_rus\textures\techn\tanks\heavy.
I personally have done this for the tiger and have added my own panther skin.
I am really looking forward to the new summer skins and have some dears of my own taken from photos and videos such as these found here http://militarymodels.co.nz/2012/03/23/the-pz-kpfw-v-panther-in-action-wartime-film-footage/ and the tank power books.

This isn't from the government. Those numbers above are the reports from war-time documents, which were marked as secret for a long time in USSR. So you have the reason to trust German documents - this is the same reason to trust the documents from the other side. If you don't - than you can't trust the documents from both sides for the same reason - it's fair to assume that propaganda editing worked for the both sides.  ;)  

As for me - when I have the reason not to trust to the reports about the numbers of the killed tanks from the both sides - I have no reason not to trust to the reports about the numbers of the lost tanks from the both sides during the war. That has nothing to do with the propaganda. The commanders need the numbers to calculate how much strength they have left in their disposal.


By the way - I forgot to mention that there were already no Ferdinands in 1944. They were modified (added zimmerit, machinegun and commander's cupola) and called Elefants. The picture from earlier showing the model of zimmerited Ferdinand is historically incorrect.

Thanks for the tip Littlebro!

Yes, I know it's incorrect. Unfortunately, we do not have an "Elefant" series Tank Destroyer to work with, only the Ferdinand.

Here are some pics of knocked out panthers being remanufackturerd and may account for some of the mixed upgrades seen.

(http://i47.tinypic.com/wvq0pg.jpg)

(http://i46.tinypic.com/xgmh5j.jpg)

Whukid if you need any reference material i have loads of pics and drawings for most tanks and spg's .
 

I need Tiger 2's, Jagdpanthers, and Panzer IV's :) Thanks for your guys' support and help!

This isn't from the government. Those numbers above are the reports from war-time documents, which were marked as secret for a long time in USSR. So you have the reason to trust German documents - this is the same reason to trust the documents from the other side. If you don't - than you can't trust the documents from both sides for the same reason - it's fair to assume that propaganda editing worked for the both sides.   

As for me - when I have the reason not to trust to the reports about the numbers of the killed tanks from the both sides - I have no reason not to trust to the reports about the numbers of the lost tanks from the both sides during the war. That has nothing to do with the propaganda. The commanders need the numbers to calculate how much strength they have left in their disposal.

I agree with you Mistwalker; as far as I am concerned Soviet field or war records are as trustworthy as the Germans ones.The only hiatus is that field commanders very much aware of avoiding the ire of the Politruk or the equivalent on the German side would either leave out some casualties or tamper with the numbers to avoid being court martialled or worse or make themselves good for promotion. And by no means this was restricted to the Soviets and Germans .The so-called democracies practised selective stats as well or tampering with the truth. For example on 24th December 1944 a UBoot sunk the American transport ship Leopoldsville off the coast of France.Over 870 men of the 960 on board perished.Yet the US Army , afraid of negative public opinion and giving the Germans propaganda material, concealed the information and told the families of the victims that their loved ones had been reported missing on various battlefields.The truth was kept secret for over 40 years...So when ti comes to battlefield reports we always have to keep in mind that army bureaucrats and officers as well sometimes have good reason to inflate enemy casllaties and minimise their own...

To each his own :)

I bring gifts! These are all prototype skins. The Jtiger and Jpanzer IV are accurate; the Ferdinand fell victim to my imagination :P

FEEDBACK IS REQUIRED

Ferdinand
(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_30_33_0003.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_30_26_0002.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_30_18_0001.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_30_10_0000.jpg)

Jagdtiger
(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_28_45_0004.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_28_34_0003.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_28_28_0002.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_28_24_0001.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_28_21_0000.jpg)

Jagdpanzer (this one's for Kyth)
(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_24_53_0000.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_24_59_0001.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_25_21_0004.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_02_22_25_35_0005.jpg)

Nice work, The ferdinand is really a big step forward, the stock skin was just awful :D

Well, it was supposed to look like this;

(http://chrisescars.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/Elefant_USAOM-01.jpg)

But I was like "you know, that ones' not much better. IMAGINATION, IGNITE" and went to town :)

Here's a Two Tone Tiger 2. I might add a third, Brown, layer to complete the tri-color scheme, however I kind've like this one :)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_03_00_01_16_0003.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_03_00_01_07_0002.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_03_00_01_00_0001.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_06_03_00_00_53_0000-1.jpg)

Hi,

Thanks, the Jpz IV already looks a thousand percent better  :)

A couple of things:

- I'd prefer if the Tiger 2 had the 3-colour camo,

- The pattern for the Elefant is good, but it might be more plausible on a Marder or Stug III.
The Ferdinand / Elefant historically had a stripey, net-like pattern with a single colour (there were only about 90 of them).

The Elefant from Aberdeen has a new paint, so the camo isn't historically correct. I have example references and will post them here.
The Tiger's II zimmerit is blurry and some bolts and elements are missing from the texture. The tank obviously needs new zimmerit applied. or no zimmerit at all.

For the other vehicles I'll try to give a feedback soon.

Hmmmmm, zimmerit might be a tough one.  :-\ It's really too bad these things didn't come with multilayer templates. Making them from scratch is a pain in the ass :P

Whukid why don't you look at pics posted on youtube.There's one KT in the Saumur museum in France which is supposed to have accurate camo.It's actually one of the rare Kts till in running condition.There's another famous one exposed in La Gleize in Luxemburg which was abandoned by the Peiper kampfgruppe in December 1944. One problem though is that , of course, the camos changed depending on the season...

I think the Zimmerit was the biggest concern for me going into the Tiger 2. Luckily for me, the compound was a paste that was put on the outside of tanks in 1944 and would harden. From what I gather, it had to be reapplied every few months or so because it would become worn and would no longer exhibit the ridges which were required to keep magnetic mines from sticking to the sides of the tank. Tanks with it on past the 1944 rescind order continued to use it without reapplying the paste, therefore making a "wear and tear" look much more likely for a late 1944-1945 era Tiger 2.

For those who disagree with my reasoning, feel free to edit it (i'll supply the rudimentary template)

As of right now importing models into SABOW has stalled. For the sake of my computer keyboard, I'll work on the late-war paint schemes alittle bit more today. I'd really like to get some schurtzen on the Stug III and Panzer III, but my 3d skills aren't up to the task.

EDIT:
my base Tiger 1 picture :)

(http://www.aikensairplanes.com/merit%20Int'l%20llc/MIL-86001.png)

Whukid do you think it would be possible to import SABoW vehciles into Steel Fry?I mean since SF vehicles appear to be exportable to the other game why not the reverse?I know that Stone 2009 had modelled a T-62 for import into SF in order to make an Aghan mod.Unfortunately he dropped the plan over a year ago....

Just as a little update;

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_29_23_06_13_0003.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_29_23_06_04_0002.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_29_23_05_44_0001.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_29_23_03_54_0000.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_29_23_01_34_0000.jpg)

Working on infantry uniforms right now :)

King Tiger and Sdfkz 251c Series (Notice the late war infantry uniforms. I have to finish the Machinegunner and the officer)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_30_01_04_36_0004.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_30_01_04_21_0003.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_30_01_03_54_0002.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_30_01_03_23_0001.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_30_01_03_06_0000.jpg)

Nice job on the 3-colour Panzer IV camo!

By the way, are they historical? Can't remember seeing either of them, in my younger days  ;D

My memory's not what it used to be,  :D I can't recall ever painting my panzers with straight lines, something to refresh my memory, perhaps?

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-legVr6I3c9o/Tw7k7ZvnOaI/AAAAAAAABhk/9JOwuqv4GGA/s1600/SANY7237.JPG)

I got it from this guy;

http://panzer100slopedarmor.blogspot.com/2011/06/panzer-iv-ausfj-eastern-front-1945.html

who got it from here

http://www.jumbliesmodels.com/model-military-vehicles-c2/forces-of-valor-german-panzer-iv-ausfj-eastern-front-1945-p1168

Ah yes, these historical moments are coming back to me now. Seems just like yesterday  ;D

Next up, the Behemoth of all skins;

Panther ausf D
(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/Panther.jpg)

Panther Ausf D, try 1

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_07_31_16_59_55_0000.jpg)

So, how do you guys like it? Added the finishing touches

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_08_01_00_20_59_0000.jpg)

(http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n585/whukid/shot_2012_08_01_00_38_42_0001.jpg)

It does appear to be an accurate representation of the tank in the picture.  :P Was it a captured Panther?

I don't believe so, but I'm not sure :P