Need some Su-2 (M-88b) experts!

[FB_AGA]

About armament.

Officially Su-2M-88B had 5 MG (SHKAS) but it seems 2 wing sometimes were removed to increase bombload.
The data according to the Research and testing institute of Red Army Air Force (NII VVS KA):

Su-2M-88B №16/2 and №20/2 January 1941 - 4 wing 7.62 shkas with 3400 bullets
Su-2M-88B №1/6modified February 1941 - 2 wing 7.62 shkas with 1700 bullets
Su-2M-88B №070T29 June 1941 - 2 wing 7.62 shkas with 2400 bullets
Su-2M-82 №15116 April 1942 - 4 wing 7.62 shkas with 3400 bullets

Turret Shkas of M-88B had 900 bullets, of M-82 had 1500 bullets.

[Flashburn]

Yes those pictures are just what I needed. 

Nothing remotely decent was popping up for me.  I was just thinking... I bet if I stuck cy2 in Cyrillic I would be swimming in stuff.     Its so late in the modeling bit that there WILL be wrong stuff in this.  =(  Hopefully as a low poly model no one will care. 

[Flashburn]

Ok so 4 FAB 100's in the bomb bay.  Certainly not alot, but with a bunch of buddies with you could mess some stuff up.  And then probably another 2 on the wings. 


WOOO..  did not realize how far back the radial engine was in the cowling.

[Flashburn]

Hmm those bomb racks for the 4 fab 50 or 100's for the wings are VARY interesting.....

[wildman]

the model is looking great so far, how long in man hours did that take you? and how many more until you complete it, best estimate?

As you know I have just started at the bottom of the ladder with 3D model making and so far I have made.....*drumroll* - *TA-DAAAAA!!!* nothing lol, still learning the basic controls

[FB_AGA]

About loads:





Sorry for some misprints   

[Flashburn]

the model is looking great so far, how long in man hours did that take you? and how many more until you complete it, best estimate?

As you know I have just started at the bottom of the ladder with 3D model making and so far I have made.....*drumroll* - *TA-DAAAAA!!!* nothing lol, still learning the basic controls

This one?  I really dont know.  Everything went wrong with this.  Including my computer nearly melting down. 

But usually a decent 10k model by itself from legit reference material is just under a week.  Usually a full week for model and unwrap and then another for textures and fixing problems. 

But it varies.  And depends on how much your after.  That F5 I made for Sabow and is also in Shield of the prophet was vary little time.  The textures where 2 evening. And not even full ones.  It shows.   

I made a quick Ah1 J model that is okish in about 9 or 10 hours.  Alot of that was looking of for photos.  But on the flip side my m38 jeep which is STILL NOT DONE.   Has easily eaten more than 3 solid weeks.  But granted with the m38 and m38C jeeps I lost motivation as they would offer NOTHING to the game right now.  For shield of the prophet they would just blow up and that is about it. 

Making tanks with interiors is really freaking time consuming.  But that is something else. 

Basic things at first take quite awhile.  but as you challenge yourself you get way faster.  My 1st serious model attempt was an Ak thingie rifle.  I must have spent a month on it.  And it was just OK.  Now a 5k firearm model with textures that would actually be good would probably be 5 days.  Maybe less.  Made a Hatsan escort shotgun with retractable stock in maybe 3 or 4 days in January. 

The G3 rifle in shield was like maybe 5 or 6 hours.  Was not much at all.  But not exactly a huge thing.  And a real low poly model.

This SU2 has been threw alot.  It will be ok in the end.  Now I am pretty much using it as a test bed to see how much detail I can dump into its textures.  Also a few other things I want to try out. 

[Flashburn]

I dont even know what those AO series are....

But I think aiming at a bunch of FAB 100's makes sense. 

[FB_AGA]

AO - antipersonal. Was widely used. The number is the weight. For example AO-25 = 25 kg antipersonal bomb. In general like german SD-1, 2, 10 and up to SD-50. In the WW2 AO-2.5 was made of rejected 45mm shell, AO-8 of 76.2mm shell, AO-25 from 122mm shell.

[Flashburn]

AO - antipersonal. Was widely used. The number is the weight. For example AO-25 = 25 kg antipersonal bomb. In general like german SD-1, 2, 10 and up to SD-50. In the WW2 AO-2.5 was made of rejected 45mm shell, AO-8 of 76.2mm shell, AO-25 from 122mm shell.

Ahhh. makes sense. Would be interesting to watch a flight of SU 2's dump a zillion little bombs...

[Flashburn]

Ok so what is the KD-2 bomb rack able to carry?   Or did I not see that info?  Always possible as I am bouncing all over the place between things. 

ERRR Never mind..  DUH the diagram .   

Shab 25 what is that?  Of XAB 25 stupid keyboard. 


Ill whip up a basic KD2 rack now.  Maybe make the KD1 later.  Hope I can guess the right proportions. 

[FB_AGA]

AO - antipersonal. Was widely used. The number is the weight. For example AO-25 = 25 kg antipersonal bomb. In general like german SD-1, 2, 10 and up to SD-50. In the WW2 AO-2.5 was made of rejected 45mm shell, AO-8 of 76.2mm shell, AO-25 from 122mm shell.

Hehe. I've tested such thing for the O&E mod.

92xSD-2 







The funny thing that right now I fail to make them spread widely. Only about 20m, otherwise Ju-87 will start to climb while still throwing them down 
When they come very narrow and approximitely at the same time my computer turns in-game speed to 0.1x for 5 - 10 seconds  But I have i7, 1Gb video and 16GB Ram 

The second ingame bug that planes always throw bombs ~ 38-40 meters forward the target and almost always hit the same point from the target. Seems dispercion and aiming error works not well with planes .... actually I asked Andrey about these issues ... but I've decided to postpone adding cluster bombs in the mod...

However, 10 - 15 SD-10 doesn't affect game speed (at least my)...still that inaccurate 

[Flashburn]

To many explosion patterns going on at 1 time.  Ok.. wont do that.   

YA the planes climbing to soon is often a odd issue.  Like when a plane uses cannons and suddenly pitches up firing for a couple more seconds.  Makes sense dumping a string of bombs it would do the same thing. 

[FB_AGA]

Shab 25 what is that?  Of XAB 25 stupid keyboard. 

Chemiсal/gas, with nerve gases, poisons and so on...was not used in WWII.

It seems that Su-2 variant with rockets carried 10 pieces as on those photos. 8 rockets it is a pre war variant.

[FB_AGA]

To many explosion patterns going on at 1 time.  Ok.. wont do that.   

YA the planes climbing to soon is often a odd issue.  Like when a plane uses cannons and suddenly pitches up firing for a couple more seconds.  Makes sense dumping a string of bombs it would do the same thing. 

Well, in July's '43 Mius IL-2 has used over 30.000 (for a half of the month) PTAB-2.5kg (HEAT bomb). In comparison to 3.500 FAB100 and about 800 FAB50. (AO25-2.5 7.000 by Il-2 + 10.500 by U-2).

They were in clusters .... probably devs will think over some current bomb problems 

[Flashburn]

It looks like the bomb rack for the internal bay is the same as external rack?  Is that right?  In which case I may have made the internal bay way to shallow.  But all i had to go off was a bad picture there too.  UGH. 

Well yes it is...  So max load is 600 kg.  So perhaps for main load out, maybe worry about more later.  4 100 FAB's in internal bay and 4 50kg fab's external.

If the light AO bombs get sorted perhaps fill the bomb bay will a whole bunch of the little ones and a couple regular fab 100's external? 

[Flashburn]

UGH... spending all my time trying to figure out this stupid bomb rack. 

SO I am guessing that it is made to hold 4 100 kg bombs on mid area.  Or up to 8 50 kg bombs on the out side portion.  Or of course similar bombs of equal weight.  Now its starting to click.  Ya Im slow right now.  The bomb rack can be mounted internal in the bay and OR 2 external on the under wings.  This sound about right?

No that does not look right either.  Clearly I am a ww2 bomb rack retard.

MAN I'm a slow kid today...

For the SU2 to fly a MAX bomb load using FAB bombs its 3 KD-2 racks with 4 FAB 50's each.  OR it looks like pretty much just 4 FAB 100's in internal bay.  Unless using the lighter little AO bombs and  doing some weird mixing of bombs.  Like 4 FAB 50's internal with a bunch of little guys on the KD1.  Which basically means your usually just flying 4 FAB 100's and likely why the SU2 ACTUALLY went away.  4 7.62 mg's and 4 bombs is not a vary useful combo.  Posted losses where never as high as other air craft.  As a bomber without a bombardier your 4 bombs are probably not hitting anywhere close.  ANd strafing killing a truck will be a challenge let alone an AFV.  Probably killing its driver but likely the truck could be repaired or simply driven away with more holes than before. 

[Flashburn]

Model in external model viewer to see all the issues that need to get sorted and a quick test to make sure normal will work right.  And of course they will...  Also since AGA's pics he found made some improvements here and there.  Now all set to redo all the damned rivets again.   

[Flanker15]

Did you still need the tyre texture?

[Flashburn]

Ya would be nice.  Its just a BONUS!  But I am guessing its general aviation sort.  Basically straight lines.